Speaker 1: 0:00

When you have a challenge, do not recall back. Look at what you have learned from that challenge you know and see how you can use that to improve and improve in what you do.

Speaker 2: 0:13

That is a snippet of our podcast today. Hello and welcome to Lead to Excel podcast, where every story sparks inspiration and every conversation brings you closer to your best self. I'm Maureen Chiana and I'm here to explore the extraordinary fusion of leadership, emotional intelligence and the groundbreaking insights of neuroscience. Whether you're leading a team, building a dream or simply on a quest for personal growth, you're in the right place, so let's dive in and transform the way we think, lead and live. Welcome aboard. I am so excited to be back with another episode of Lead to Excel podcast. I am actually smiling because I am with a very, very good friend of mine. She's a friend, she's a sister and we've known each other for a lot, a lot of years, so today I'm so honored to have Dr Njide Okonjo-Udochi with us today. Dr Njide, thank you for coming on to Lead to Excel podcast.

Speaker 1: 1:28

Oh, I'm so excited to be here. You know, I'm really happy to be able to be on this podcast and to share, you know, whatever knowledge that I have. You know, it's so nice to be with someone who is not just a friend but actually a sister. We go back so many years.

Speaker 2: 1:48

Many, many years. We've known each other since we were very young, so it's such an honor to have you on the podcast today and it's something I've wanted to do and I think I did mention it to you a few years ago that we've got to get onto the podcast, and that's really because I've seen so much of what you do. You do so much in your medical profession and outside your medical profession and I want us to really talk about it today. But let us go back a bit to growing up. Kind of grew up, I think it was in Ghana and then so yeah, take us back a bit. How was it growing up as a young girl in Ghana, nigeria? Tell us a bit about that.

Speaker 1: 2:36

You know, a lot of people ask me that you know how was it growing up? I think it was just what actually shaped me the life experiences that I had, the parents that I had growing up with two academics both my parents were professors. My dad worked for the United Nations and we lived first of all in Nsukka my dad worked in the Department of Economics and my mom in the Department of Sociology and living in a university community that shapes you and really you know you are around, surrounded by a lot of you know intellectual people who just you know you can't help. You know learning from them. You know, and imbibing you know their values. And then from there, I mean I remember we had uh, professor Chinua, achebe, people that you hear about now, legends you know, um, and luminaries, that that you hear and people look up to, um talking and and and visiting our homes and influencing our upbringing. In those days it's not like now. You know you have to be very careful. But and then from there we moved to Ghana and I was also in the university community.

Speaker 1: 3:52

Even though my father worked for the United Nations, he loved being challenged academically, so he loved the university community, so I grew up at the University of Ghana and actually learned how to speak Chwee and Ga, which are two languages in Ghana. And growing up then you know it taught me to you know to be able to be flexible, to meet people from different parts of the world. A lot of my dad's colleagues were from all over the world Bangladesh. You know India, you know different parts of Africa, the US and so on, and so it's you. And then you grew up with their kids. So, plus, we had a lot of our Ghanaian friends in school. So it just taught you to be able to be flexible and to you know embrace people for who they are.

Speaker 1: 4:48

And it also showed us that everybody's the same. We all want the same things. It doesn't matter where you're from. You know we have the same values. You know, going into different people's homes, our friends at that time, what my father was telling me was what their parents were telling them. So, from all over. And then so I think, for us as children, it really shaped us. You know the ability to to love anybody you know it doesn't matter where they are from and to to learn that we are all the same and to be respectful of people, no matter what. So I will say uh, my sister and I like to say, you know, and my other siblings that were detribalized or denationalized, we just love people for who they are yeah, yeah, and that actually comes out in in the way you live as well.

Speaker 2: 5:40

And still back in when we're young, I want to ask you a question, because I remember when we were young at school, you were one person because we were actually in the same class and you were so studious I would look at Inchide studying so much and I would go. I should be doing this, but you know, I'm going to confess true confession here I wasn't very good at doing that. So, Nchide, what was driving you at that age? What was it that made you? Because it's almost like you were so focused, you knew what you wanted and you were so determined. How did you? What was it? How did that come about or what was the thought process at that time?

Speaker 1: 6:27

You know, I mean a lot of people ask me that because I've always been, you know, like, really focused and really studious. I think part of it is just my parents Both my parents were professors. They expected the best from us and they demanded excellence and being, you know, my father's child, my mom's child, I just they, they really gave us goals. You know, before you went to school there was a goal you had to be. Nobody had in any class. You had to work hard. My dad told us, you know, you would always talk about the Biafran war and how they lost everything and how he built up from that to where he is today. And you know, and he would tell us to just not look at the immediate you know attractions of being a child, but to think about the future and what you want to become, and to the only way to do that was to work hard and be focused, not follow a follower. You know, and he, he believes so much in the power of academics and that excelling will get you to wherever. And my dad would say, you know, it's not. It's not okay for you to be the best in one subject. You have to be the best in one subject. You have to be the best in every subject. You have to. If somebody has one degree, you have to get three so that when it comes to time you know to, to succeed, you know, or to excel, or to be chosen for something, you will be the one that is chosen.

Speaker 1: 8:00

He was obsessed with you know, being successful and education, and he believed in the power of working hard and being focused, even at an early age. So he instilled that in me and I just think I mean I looked up to my parents. I saw the kind of you know, the values they had and the way they behaved. They were very hardworking people and so I just copied what I saw. You know I just you know was emulating what I saw at home. And I knew that in order for me to be successful, I had to work hard and I couldn't be distracted by whatever was going on in school at the time. I know it seems cliche, but honestly, at that early age, that's all I wanted to do. I knew I had to do work and excel and there was no other way but to study.

Speaker 2: 8:52

That's amazing. That was amazing and I like what you've said in terms of you go back to school with goals and it's so, that's so important and you can see the impact it's had on all, all of you. You know the way you were brought up and the impact it's had on how you've all turned out and that's really incredible and it's something that people don't even realize that, as your parents were driving you to, to excellence or for excellence, it was wiring your brain to be that focus, to be excellent. So that because, honestly, I remember you and it was excellence you always went for excellence, you were very studious, you knew why you were there and you focused on that and I could see it even play out in your life as an adult as well. That, and I could see it even play out in your life as an adult as well. So that's, you know, I think for us as parents, or for young parents growing up, this is a big lesson Whatever you sow into your kids will determine what they become tomorrow. So it's so important those goals you set, what you tell them, your expectations of them, really makes a difference. Thank you so much for sharing that with us and it's amazing. Your incredible parents are truly incredible, honestly.

Speaker 2: 10:13

So Inchiday what made you decide to study medicine? Why medicine specifically?

Speaker 1: 10:21

You know, actually I love art. Anyone who knows me knows that I love art. You can see behind me I have a true because your house.

Speaker 1: 10:29

Yes, I'm obsessed with that. So I'm a very pretty person, I like decorating, um, and I really thought I was going to do architecture because I loved, um, art and interior design. But, um, that's, that's just my. And, if you remember, in school we had an art class and I was always there with a teacher and you know I just love creativity and and that. So, um, but I was really hard, I was going, I was very good in science and my mom, uh, kept on telling me you know, you're good in, you know you should be a doctor, you know, and in those days it's not now you tell kids you know, do this.

Speaker 1: 11:11

And they're like no, I want to do whatever. I. Because I looked up to my parents, you know, they would say you need to be a physician, you need to be a physician. And I said, ok, you know. And then in school, at Queens College, lagos, you know, we had a school guidance counselor and I went up to them and I said you know, my parents want me to be a doctor. And they said, yeah, you're very smart, you should do medicine, you know. So that's actually what got me interested. I wasn't like, my father wasn't a physician, neither was my mom. They were both academics, but I started. Then I started, you know, exploring it even more myself, you know, reading up, you know more about medicine and biology and so on, and I found out that I loved it. You know it was like a novel. So I said, ok, I'm going to try this. And that's actually how I got myself into medicine. And then I applied to go to medical school, you know, in Nigeria. And then, you know, I got in and the rest is history.

Speaker 2: 12:15

So now I want you to tell us about this history. So can you just tell us briefly who Inchide is? What do you do? Because you, I know you run, you're the CEO of Summit Medical Group and I know you had a a practice general practice before that. So can you tell us a bit about what you do at the moment?

Speaker 1: 12:39

yeah, um, so, yes, I'm a family physician, I'm also a geriatrician. I like to say that because, um, uh, even though I'm a family doctor, I did a fellowship in geriatrics because of my dad. He was a statistician and he insisted that, because of the way the statistics was working out, if I was going to be in the United States I needed to do a fellowship in geriatrics. Geriatrics is really about taking care of older people, so I specialize in that. But, you know, following that, you know I did work for Mercy Medical Center.

Speaker 1: 13:19

After my residency and fellowship, you know, I got married, I had little kids and I needed a job that would combine preventive medicine, clinical medicine and give me time to be able to raise my young family. So at that time I decided to look for a public health job, a job that combined both public health work as well as clinical work, and I was hired by Mercy Medical Center to run the health care for the homeless program in Baltimore City. And that was so rewarding because I was able to blend my public public health experience and my clinical practice as the medical director for for healthcare for the homeless. This was one of the most rewarding experiences in my career because it was during the time of the AIDS epidemic and I was just there and if you think back then, there was a big outbreak of, you know, an epidemic also of drug substance abuse. So I got involved in addiction medicine, hiv medicine, in order to be able to deal, to actually take care of these patients. So, working with the homeless, it really inspired me because you had to create a new system for them.

Speaker 1: 14:42

Who wants to take care of homeless patients, you know, without having, you know, a holistic approach to it? You had to bring in specialists because a lot of them had needs that you know were far more than primary care doctors could do. You needed social workers, you needed addiction counselors and basically, you had to create a home for them. So that enabled me to create what I call a patient-centered medical home, aligning other specialists to us so that there were people who could come into the practice, deal with their mental health issues. We had psychiatrists, we had social workers, we had addiction counselors and I saw how the outcomes were just phenomenal. The patients who came in, the homeless patients, did so much better. They had all their care in one space, including the specialty care, you know, and we had people were referring to who had the same vision and goals and who really saw the mission of what we're trying to do and create a healthcare for the homeless.

Speaker 1: 15:48

So with that in mind, after several years of working there, I decided to start my own practice. That's how I found Millennium Family Practice, which was a solo private practice which I had for several years. And then, of course, when my son became a physician and he decided to do internal medicine, I enticed him into being a primary care doctor to continue the kind of work that I was doing and because it was, it's so rewarding to be able to take care of people right to you where they keep house of medicine, as they say. He did internal medicine and so he was a different specialty and I wanted to see how I could expand my practice and get other people involved into the same kind of model of care that I had used that was so successful previously at health care for the homeless.

Speaker 1: 16:46

So in creating Summit Medical Group, it's what I like to call my own patient centered medical home that has other physicians. So we have other physicians in our practice. We have psychiatric nurse practitioners, we have a nutritionist, you know. We have therapists. So the whole idea is to have care in one space, and that necessitated the importance of having a building where people could be in and the specialist could also be in the same space, to enable patients be more compliant, to make it easier for them to access specialty care and access services. So we have lab work there, we have other specialists that we have a pharmacy.

Speaker 1: 17:30

So it's in creating this care that enabled me to, you know, actually go out and show that when you actually have a vision that you can accomplish it, you know, and improve health care for the population that you're serving.

Speaker 1: 17:51

For the population that we serve is mostly minorities and immigrants, you know, and so that population, as you can see, they have so many challenges with social determinants of health challenges with social determinants of health, and so having some having everything in one space makes it easier for compliance, you know, and helps them, you know, achieve the goals that they have to do as far as their healthcare is and it has been, you know, really a blessing for us to be able to do this and help demonstrate that even minorities, you can improve their health indices and their health outcomes, you know, by, you know, having care that is more of a holistic approach and care that recognizes the challenges they face and you address those challenges for them.

Speaker 1: 18:40

They can do very well. So that's that. So I'm the CEO of Summit Medical Group and I'm just blessed to have an incredible you know support staff. You know the providers that we have are very, very, very bought into the vision of what we're doing. It's, it's like it's a, it's a mission to be able to help this population and to actually move the needle in improving health outcomes for this population here in the United States.

Speaker 2: 19:08

That's incredible. That's amazing, and I love the fact that it's almost like a one-stop shop, one place where everyone comes. What has been the challenge, though, for you in terms of navigating this route? Because one of the things you talked about was when you were working with HIV mental health and I know it's rewarding, but what were the challenges you faced in terms of working with homeless people, people with HIV in the 90s? How did you find that and how has that helped, or how did that help you in terms of you know later, or of you know after you left that aspect?

Speaker 1: 19:55

so I know, um, the, what I learned. There's nothing more valuable than actually being there, being part of the, the solution. Um, as you can be, as you can everybody. If you think back, you know you see it was a very challenging time during the HIV epidemic. But one of the things I learned is that you have to individualize care. You have guidelines, but when patients are people, everybody's different and you can take the guidelines and you know you make it and fashion it to that particular patient. So we would use different regimens. You know entry and that what we call a heart therapy, we I would create different regimens to, to for the patients so that they would do better, being still being aware of what the guidelines were. So that was one of the things I I learned and also I learned that it's so, it's so, it's so important to involve other people, to collaborate.

Speaker 1: 20:51

You know it's very challenging to deal with this population. You can't do it alone and I am so happy because when I went to get my MBA and, uh, I went back to Cornell to learn more about the business of medicine and health policy, because you get to a certain point in your life you have to know about how to survive as an entity, an organization, a business, and also what policy drives it, what I call the political determinants of health. What are those policies that can drive the industry that you're in and how can you influence that? So, going back to Cornell, it really reinforced what my belief was that you have to know. You know that you teamwork, collaboration is the way to go, and I was doing this during the COVID pandemic, and the lessons that I learned during the HIV epidemic came to play for us, because at that time, we had a core group of providers in the city and it was those same providers that I called together to say look, we have this pandemic, we need to work together to make sure we're saving people's lives. And so we formed that WhatsApp group. And so we formed that WhatsApp group. We were learning from each other, looking and seeing what providers were doing, other physicians were doing in China, in Europe, in the United Kingdom, in Italy. We're learning from that to try to use those lessons to also help our patients here in the United States. So all that you know, if, if COVID didn't teach us anything, it taught us that you have to work together, you have to collaborate to go far.

Speaker 1: 22:33

It's not a competition, it's wins. Collaboration wins over competition, and I say this a lot to people. You know you, we can all win. You know it doesn't have to be just use being successful. Bring others in work with other people around you, and that's the policy and the way that I've done my work over the years. I like to say that there are enough patients for everybody and we need doctors of all stripes and in all specialties, so there's no need to fight over patient turf or anything like that. I can have any primary care doctor move next to me. There are patients who want to see that kind of physician and patients who want to see us.

Speaker 1: 23:13

So because of that it's you know the lessons that that taught me and what we did during the COVID pandemic that saved a lot of people's lives show that it is so, so important to have other people with you as you try to implement change, and to have other people with you as you try to reach a larger population, a larger community. If you want to have an impact, and have an impact that is outstanding, you have to bring others, because you don't know it all. It's so interesting when you have other people and you're collaborating, how those people, the other group or the other company, you know what they bring, the expertise, you know, just talking with them changes the direction and actually moves the needle even farther than you would think. So I believe in the power of collaboration, you know, with other people. So that's what it's really taught me and so that is, you know, the premise with which I, you know I run my business, is a premise with which, you know, I do all the things that I do now and in trying to look for people who will work with us to improve healthcare, not only here in the United that I do now, and in trying to look for people who will work with us to improve healthcare, not only here in the United States, because now, with technology and we know, now we have digital technology we can even expand care into Africa and help, you know, our continent, which I love so much, you know, to help the providers there through, you know, using digital technology, doing second opinion consults, so to improve, you know, the care that is being provided there there's a lot of challenges in Nigeria and other African countries and also to find a way to, you know, employ the youth.

Speaker 1: 25:01

You know, I know that there's so many challenges we have here with human resources. I know that there's so many challenges we have here with human resources and one of the things that I've been doing, one of my projects, is actually working with an organization, center for Social Awareness. You know, forming a trifecta of companies Summit Medical Group with them, with CSAE, as well as First Patient Engagement three of us coming together to make sure that youth are trained in Nigeria and that the youth are also trained and able to work. We offer employment to these youth so that they can support practices here in the US remotely, and that is how my you know, the organization that we have, our group, has been working because these youth, they're really, really skilled and I'm telling you, if you look at what the Nigerian youth, you know how talented they are, even with the limited resources you, you, it will blow your mind.

Speaker 1: 26:11

So I, you know I have a lot of them. You know, helping our practice, front and the front office, as well as back office. You know things like virtual, acting as virtual assistants, helping with answering the phones, you know medical receptionist. These are opportunities that now exist, that didn't exist before. We had digital technology right, and they also help alleviate the work that we do. So there's a center in Apapa that houses, you know, these employees.

Speaker 2: 26:46

So you provide them with accommodation.

Speaker 1: 26:49

Yes, there's accommodation. There's also a digital center, a call center?

Speaker 1: 26:58

Yes, a call center where they go to and you know it's all secure, hipaa compliant and working with First Patient Engagement and us. We've been able to demonstrate this and we're actually planning to scale this across the United States to different physicians you know and practices all over the US, you know, and beyond. It just shows that once you work with other people, you can put like minds together and do something that has a positive impact. It will help youth unemployment in Nigeria, provide them with money because they get paid for the work they do. It helps. It's a win win situation, you know it. It helps the physicians here in the US run their practices even better. The US run their practices even better, and those same people, those same youth, can also be trained with two other. There are so many other aspects of medicine I mean in terms of front and back office jobs that they can do. That actually helps a practice move forward and helps the workflow.

Speaker 2: 28:05

Gosh, this is just incredible and I think I'm listening to you and I want I think one thing that really comes through is your passion. Your passion for what you do really always comes through and I want to ask you a question about about you, before I come back to the business again. Your parents were academics. Where did you get your business acumen from? Because you just did an MBA recently, so your business acumen has been way back. Where did that come from? How did that develop? Because I just see how you that developed, because I just see how you, even listening to you speaking the way you can, you're very visionary about what you do and it's incredible and the key thing, another thing that really comes through is the confidence to collaborate, because a lot of leaders shy away from collaboration out of fear of competition, but you actually embrace it and that is a skill of a great business person and a confident person. So where did this come from? How or when did you notice or how, how did you nurture yourself to to to be like that?

Speaker 1: 29:23

I um. The word that they say in uh say in business is to differentiate. It is so important for you to know the population you want to work with and to do something that other people are not doing, and that's what they call differentiation. If you want to be successful, you have to differentiate.

Speaker 1: 29:46

I knew earlier on that I wasn't a hospital based physician. I wanted to be outpatient. I felt like that was where my value was going to be, and my value proposition was to offer something that was different from what was being offered years ago at that time. At that time so in around 2003, 2004, I was like you know, what can I do? That is different. Focus on the population that I love minorities, immigrants but also, you know, provide services on the weekends, on the evenings, do something that other people were not doing at that time, before we started having urgent cares and things like you know, and walk-in clinics and so on then. And so it's that, with that in mind, you know, having a clear vision of where you want to go and what you want to do, that really, you know, helped me focus and, you know, continue to do the work and the rewards, to see the rewards of the patients doing better.

Speaker 1: 30:48

And also you know I've had challenges. You know it's not easy. People see you and they think, oh, everything is all so good. There's nobody who is in business who doesn't know how difficult and challenging it is. You know, first of all as a woman. Then you know as a minority, as an immigrant in a country. You have to jump through a lot of hoops. How do you get lines of credit to be able to buy equipment to see patients and so on? It's a constant struggle. But it's in knowing and being confident that what you're doing brings value and having a long view. I always tell people you know I have a long view of medicine, you know. You know if you have a long view and you know that the services you're going to provide will make a difference and not looking for the profit the next day, you know, if you provide excellent services, people are going to come to you. In Nigeria we say better market sells itself, so I don't advertise. I allow the services that I provide to make a difference in the lives of the patients that come in there and they are the ones that bring others.

Speaker 1: 31:59

And that's how I was able to grow and it's been challenging as far as how I learned it, honestly it was organic. I didn't really go to business school. I read a lot and I like to look at people who are successful. And also I have to say that I've had mentors and I've had advocates, and I always tell people, when you're looking for mentors or advocates for you, it doesn't necessarily have to be a woman, a black person. My mentor was a white man who saw in me something that he felt was good and he would guide me. He would come to me, would meet, he would tell me what was going on in the community, what I needed to do to reposition myself, and so having mentorship and having someone to look up to was so critical, you know, for me as a young doctor then, and you know so I would say that that really helped me and to guide me over the years. And I'm going to give a shout out always to Dr Lauren Silverberg, who saw something in me and was my biggest cheerleader, pushing me and telling me to you know, get out of my comfort zone, liaise with people who were not like me.

Speaker 1: 33:15

I, you know, I have friends in all the communities. I would say, you know, it doesn't matter my specialists, that I really form a collaboration with all over the world. They're white, they're black from all everywhere. All over the world, they are white, they are black from everywhere all over the Middle East, everywhere and it allows you to get into different communities. I have to shout out to Dr Daisy O'Parl, a radiologist, who I work with.

Speaker 1: 33:38

So it's very, very rewarding for me to be able to use what I'm learning from other people seeing what other people are doing, what is it that is working for them and learn from them. You don't have to be jealous about anyone you know and I think that's what holds back a lot of people Envy and jealousy blocks your you know your rewards. When you see someone who is successful, what I want to do is this person is doing well, this group is doing well, this hospital is doing well. What are they doing to do well? That's all that comes to me. How can I use their lesson to improve on me? What is it that I can learn from them? So I usually will gravitate towards people who are positive, people who see you know what I want to do, who I see I can look up to, and my whole thing is about learning. So I want to learn from them.

Speaker 1: 34:35

How is it that you made a difference in your community? How is it that you made a difference in your practice? How are you surviving? That's what I ask them first, and learning from them teaches me to use those lessons to see how I can use that to implement whatever I have to do for my business. So that's, that's really how I started with my business, growing my business and learning from there. And also I've had setbacks. You know medicine in the United States.

Speaker 2: 35:05

Talk to us a bit sorry I was going to say talk to us a bit about setbacks you've had or challenges and how you've navigated that. You don't even have to go into too much detail, but just you know, kind of give us a flair for what, how challenging it has been and how you, you know what helped you, whether it's mentally, whether it's people around you to get through that.

Speaker 1: 35:33

So medicine in the US, you know, you get very good clinical training, but you never get training about the business of medicine. And one of the things I didn't know at the time was that anything that is done in your office, even if it's done by a contracted entity, actually comes back to you. You know, and nobody's told that we don't learn what they call billing and coding. We don't, we basically contract it out. We don't have classes, we are not trained in that. You only learn that when you go into practice. You know, and then you're taught here and there. You know one class here, one class there. It's not really a comprehensive training on that and that is so, so important. So the what I learned, you know, I learned by myself, you know through self-help books, you know looking at. You know working with different billing companies and so on, and I had challenges where a billing company actually came in and was billing wrongly, you know, and of course this was a contracted entity, and what ended up happening was I ended up having to be the one to bear the brunt of it, you know, to be the one who had to refund money because they did something that was wrong, they used the wrong coding. But what did I do with that? You know, it was a very difficult time. It taught me a lot. I spoke with my father and he said to me NJ, when you have this challenge, what do you do? You have two ways to look at challenges, or what you call failures. Now you can learn from it or you can recall back and be defeated by it. And I think a lot of times, when people face challenges in their life, the first thing you want to do is to retreat, you know. But no, what you need to do is say this happened and what can I learn from this and how can I navigate this to make things better? And it was so important for me because, guess what, my son was a physician and I needed to know more.

Speaker 1: 37:44

So what I did was enroll in Cornell, at the Johnson School, to do an MBA so I could learn more about the business of medicine, and then in the medical school in New York to learn about health policy. What are those drivers that we have here that I can learn from? And how can we influence it? At physicians? Because you can be a doctor, you can get all these degrees, but how do you get politicians and policymakers to change, to actually see that what those policies, or to implement policies that help you as a practicing physician and help your patients. And so that's why I went to business school and then, as I did that and explored that, I said you know, this is not something that I need to use just for the United States. I need to use this global. So that's why I enrolled in the Harvard program and completed the certificate in global health as a global health leader and learning from so many wonderful and talented individuals, and I will tell you that this really helped me.

Speaker 1: 38:52

You know so you need to look at failure. For me, what it taught me is whenever you have a challenge, you know so you need to look at failure. For me, what it taught me is whenever you have a challenge or failure, whatever you want to call it you want to look at that and use that to actually catapult yourself, as we say in Nigeria, to something even better. How do you use what has happened to you for the greater good? You know, um, and so there's so many physicians who have gone through challenges in their practice and the first thing they do is you know they don't want to practice medicine and so on. But no, you know, you have spent so many years doing this. When you have a challenge, do not recall back. Look at what you have learned from that challenge, you know, and see how you can use that to improve and improve in what you do.

Speaker 1: 39:40

And I learned so much about different companies in the business school that failed and actually risen and done better. You learn a lot. It was so much, so good to be back in an academic setting to learn from other individuals. My classmates all of them at Cornell were wonderful in helping me navigate. You know the business, you know business world and to see really taught me about how you can make a difference in your community, how you can use the knowledge that you have to improve the practicing life of physicians. So I'm so.

Speaker 1: 40:16

You know you hear a lot about physician burnout and so on. I love what I do and I want other physicians who are there to also love their specialty. So how can we improve the practice climate of doctors? How do we get other physicians to love what they do and they're not moving to other occupations? And they're not moving to other occupations is by making sure that when they practice, that they feel valued, that they feel included, that they feel, you know, that their work situation does not cost them what they now call burnout. You know, making sure that they get paid for the work that they do, you know. So it's for me. It's really got me into digital technology and trying to see how we could use technology to improve practice. You know the practice patterns and workflows for physicians, because that's really what really bothers us. We have to go back home and chart, you know, and spend hours instead of hanging out with our spouses and children and friends and family. We're doing work at home. So what can we do to improve, you know, the practicing life of physicians, whether it's a front office work and back office work.

Speaker 1: 41:22

And I talked before about using, you know, digital or, I'm sorry, virtual receptionists, but you could reuse technology to for scribing. You know, using AI. Ai has been so helpful in helping, you know, us reconnect with patients, because when you're on the computer typing what a patient is saying, you're not really engaging that patient. The patient is. It's as if you're more engaged with the computer. You know you're doing what you have to do to show that the patient came in, but patients don't really value that. I'm working with immigrants and minority. You really need to be there, you have to be. They have to feel you, your presence. So AI has been so helpful, using AI scribing, you know. So you have your AI on when I, when I'm seeing patients and I'm talking to them, and it's able to actually recreate the whole visit for me and you know, I'm old now, you know, so typing is not my, you know, my, you know. This really helps me type up the whole visit. It captures everything.

Speaker 1: 42:26

So for me, you know, I think that doctors should embrace you know technology and use it to augment the work that they do, and this is really what I've really gotten involved with. So I'm really working at the intersection of health technology as well as medicine, advising some startups on what they can do, what they're bringing to you know, creations and innovations that can help physicians in their practice. You know, and it's nice to be able to be a consultant to these startups, because I believe that it's only when you have a practicing physician who is actually doing the work that you can actually have them do innovations that really matter, that really move the needle in the right direction. There are a lot of innovations that are coming out in technology and health technology, but a lot of times they don't really meet the needs of the people who are using them. So being a physician who can advise these startups in what they're doing has been very rewarding to me, because I know that with what I'm doing, you know, and the work that I'm providing for them, the advice, you know, the consultation, the end product will be something that is definitely will be more useful to other physicians in their places of work and as and help their workflow, um, whether they're in the hospital system or our patient. So it's, it's really been um amazing.

Speaker 1: 44:07

You know I'm not a digital technology. You know, uh, lover, I love technology. I see that passion. You know what? How can we digitize this? Everything is you know, how can we create something to make it better? And and I think it's also a nice, because with technology, you can immediately see what impact you're making, you can quantify it is very measurable can use the data you have to actually, you know, show whether you're trying to get a line of credit or you're trying to get more grants or whatever to do your work, to show the impact of what you're doing and manage you know especially AI and make sure that you know, communities that we serve.

Speaker 1: 44:57

You know that whatever is being done is addressed, you know, but for the overall, I think that technology in medicine has been, you know, really, really revolutionary in trying to help us improve practice and also help us with improving access access to care. Now you can do telemedicine as patients in Nigeria and Ghana or Liberia and help those physicians manage those patients where we know that we have a shortage of physicians and providers all over the continent. With technology, we are able to make an impact and help save lives of people who are on the continent with actually being there. So you don't have to do a medical mission to be able to help a physician group, whether it's in Liberia or in Sierra Leone or Ghana or Nigeria, to change and improve the work that they're doing to help patients there. So, and to actually be an advisor. You can do this, you know, in real time, and so it's very rewarding to me.

Speaker 2: 46:09

Wow, and Jay, that's you know. You've really touched on so much and I think listening to you is just so inspiring. I want to ask you a question. I know we're almost coming on today. I want to ask you a question about using AI during consultation, especially with minority groups. Have you found any form of resistance? Do they hesitate? Do they get concerned that you have AI recording what they're saying? How has that been?

Speaker 1: 46:40

I mean, actually it's been embraced, because I think, first of all, you really have to let them know what it is. People get very worried when they think that you know they're being recorded or you're using technology to record them. But it's in, really, you know they're being recorded or you're using technology to record them, but it's in, really, you know, explaining what you're doing. So we start off by you know, really informing the patients about what we're doing. And, you know, once they see it and once the note is done, I can show it to them, they can read it. They are just amazed, you know, because it allows, they see that it allows me to actually be more present during the office visit.

Speaker 1: 47:20

So, you know, I know that a lot of minority patients, you know, have reservations when it comes to technology and AI and so on. But, honestly, it's in how you explain it to the patient, how is this going to bring value to that patient interaction during that? And they can see, because I have it on and I'm just, you know, talking to them, you know, chatting to them, you know, and getting their history and it's, you know, it's been very helpful. At the end of the visit, they can see what the end result is they can look at the encounter and see whether there's anything they want to add to it or remove from it, and so it's just being transparent. I think when you're not, that's where it creates a problem, you know so. It's been embraced wholeheartedly by our patient population.

Speaker 2: 48:12

Yeah, thank you so much for sharing that, because I think the point you raise about speaking to them, communication is so important. I always say, when you communicate, the emotional brain calms down. So even if they were worried before, it just calms them down and then they're able to really talk. They're able to really instead of being worried about oh, what are you recording, what am I going to say, what I need to be careful, what I'm saying. That way they're not actually telling you exactly what, why they've come, and you as well cannot be present and listening to them. And I think it's just fantastic that you shared that. But that key point of communicate with them just communication is so powerful and you see, there's just so much.

Speaker 2: 49:03

You touched on that. I just love the challenge you went through, but how you dealt with it, how you deal with those challenges, is just incredible and it's a lesson for everyone listening that when challenges come, what do you do? Do you freeze, do you run away, or do you stop and process it and learn from it and move forward? And what you did is just incredible. You decided to actually go out and learn and equip yourself, empower yourself and come back and then gave birth to Summit Medical Group, which is just incredible. So honestly, NJ, it's just. It's a pleasure really chatting with you and I want to touch on two things before we finish. You talked about a mentor. You talked about a mentor and I think my question is did you, did the mentor come to you? Did he see something in you? Or were you the one that actually reached out to him to mentor you? How did that? How did that start?

Speaker 1: 50:08

so he um my mentor was a professor in my program during my residency and during that time we formed, you know, I was very interested in learning about outpatient practice and what we could do and I saw that the way he was teaching me and the things he taught us as residents was something that I really wanted to emulate. So I reached out to him and I said to him I would like to learn from you. You are someone who you know embodies the kind of doctor I would like to be and he was so Just you know, and we developed a relationship over the years where he led me and helped me actually start my practice and build my practice. So you have to reach out. You have to look for someone who inspires you, who, someone who you know you want to be like, somebody who who really creates those positive moments in you and has a vision. You know that that can that you really want, you know to have. Is there someone in your life that you can look up to to say I want to be like this person and reach out to someone around you and see whether they can mentor you.

Speaker 1: 51:34

So I did reach out and it's been a wonderful relationship over 30 years and he's been by my side through every single thing that I've done and introduced me to so many people, has been very helpful, worked through the ups and downs of business and practice, and that's what people need. You need somebody who is an advocate for you, who will be in that room when you're not, who will speak up and tell people the kind of person you are. And it doesn't have to be someone who is from your town, your village you know, this is a white man that helped me, so it can be anyone. Someone who embodies who you would like to be, like, so, and someone who inspires. So I mean, that's how I met Dr Silverberg.

Speaker 2: 52:26

Yeah, no, that's amazing. You were proactive, you reached out to him, and I ask that question because a lot of times, people sit back waiting for someone to come to them or hesitating from doing something. But you've got to be so proactive and reach out to people and, like you said, it doesn't have to be someone that looks like you. It could be anyone, someone that has you know that you see something and that can help you. Thank you so much. The other thing I want to talk about probably the last thing before we go is I want to say congratulations.

Speaker 2: 53:04

Congratulations, because you are a multiple award winner and it's a lot, and a lot of it as well, apart from the medical side, is the philanthropic work you do. You do so much, you give so much back. Even listening to you in terms of the digital work you're doing in Nigeria and Africa is incredible how you really bring people up, train people, bring people up, and you've got an award recently, because I remember seeing it on LinkedIn and it was the Philanthropic Award from the Center for Social Awareness, advocacy and Ethics and it's you know. I know from talking to you. It's something to do with really helping to empower people in terms of leadership and a lot. But talk to us a bit about some of the philanthropy work you do, because you do so much and it's just incredible and it just goes to show. You know, sometimes I'm listening to you or watching you and I'm going, where does she get all this energy? But the good thing about you is you work hard and you play hard. You know, because you, yeah, go on yeah, sorry about that.

Speaker 1: 54:23

Yeah, I think you have to have a balance right. You know I work really hard, but I also take time out for myself, you know, and my family. I take time out for myself and my family. I love to travel, and so myself and my family I love to travel, and so I like seeing new places, visiting, relaxing, being with family. So there has to be a balance in your life, otherwise you're going to be burnt out, and you have, you won't have anything to give, so you have to retool. So I certainly do that.

Speaker 1: 54:52

And one of the things that I love is really working with nonprofits nonprofits that embody my values, and the Center for Social Awareness, advocacy and Ethics is an organization run by Catholic priests and it's, you know, the founder is a Catholic priest, father God's will, he's Nigerian and everything. When he, when he talked about founding this organization and what he wanted to do, I was 100% behind him. I'm like you got to do this, we have to do this. We have to help the youth in Nigeria. We have to do things to help young people. They are our future. You know we're going to get old someday, and so I've been working with them over the years, you know, supporting them financially and otherwise to to get to where they are today. And also I had this another organization near and dear to me that was on their board Luminous. It works with immigrants in in the Howard County area and beyond.

Speaker 1: 55:45

And so you know, I do a lot of work with nonprofit organizations that really embody what my values are and try and support them that really embody what my values are and try and support them. And I always tell people, you know, supporting an organization is not just about money, it's also about you can give of your time, right Advice, you can give them connections. You can help in so many different ways. It's not just, oh, I don't want to help because they're going to ask me for money. There's so many things you can do, you know, to help organizations that really bring in value to improving the world that we live in.

Speaker 1: 56:23

So, yeah, so that's. I don't even see it as work. You know it's so nice to be able to, you know, help these organizations survive and thrive so that they can continue the work that they do, because it really helps us. You know. It helps us globally, helps us, you know, wherever we are, when you have nonprofits that are doing things that are necessary to make life better for us as citizens of the world. So I just look out for those kinds of organizations and I try to support them as best that I can, as I can. So, yeah, that's. That's really what my life, lives, work and what I do on the side.

Speaker 2: 57:03

Yeah, nj, you're an incredible, incredible woman, incredible friend, incredible sister. I'm so honored and thank you so much for taking time out to come and spend this time talking to me, because it really it wasn't long. I asked you to do this and you said, yes, I'm in. Thank you so much. I really do appreciate it. One thing that I'm just going to say again, something you said that I think I want to re-emphasize for everyone listening is that concept of differentiate.

Speaker 2: 57:40

When I asked NJ about what really drives her, how did she what? How did she get to where? You know where she is today, how did she manage the challenges? And one of the things she said is differentiate, differentiate, do something other people are not doing, you know. Look for. You know. Differentiate yourself, do something different, look for those things you know, look for where there's a need and create the solution.

Speaker 2: 58:11

Thank you so, so much. And you've really shown that throughout your life. So so much. And you've really shown that throughout your life, and it's so. I think your life is a good example of the importance of what parents sow into children's lives. You know, because when you sow that, it then comes out, and I'm so honored to really to know you and for you to come on to this program, and I'll say congratulations once again for the awards and for what you're doing. Can you now just end this podcast by just leaving one great, you know, word or advice, of wisdom for our listeners? You have given us so much, but just the last one that we will take away with us.

Speaker 1: 58:54

Yeah, thank you so much for having me. For everyone listening, I will say you know that you have only one life to live. Make a difference.

Speaker 2: 59:03

Make a difference. That's a good one to end it, thank you. Thank you so much, nj. Thank you so much. I really appreciate you. Yes, and listeners, remember, please subscribe to this podcast and share, share, share. Njidia has left so much with us today. She's really opened herself up and given us so much nuggets, so I look forward to seeing you all in the you know, catching up again and be with you in our next episode. Thank you for listening.